SUBJECTS: ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY, TOONDAH HARBOUR, END OF YEAR

REBECCA LEVINGSTON, HOST: Some really strong language from Australia’s Environment Minister yesterday. Tanya Plibersek came to Brisbane and said, “Nature is being destroyed. Businesses are waiting too long for decisions. That’s bad for everyone. Things have to change.” Tanya Plibersek says Australia’s environment laws are broken so yesterday she announced an overhaul by introducing national standards and an Environment Protection Agency with enforcement powers. Tanya Plibersek, good morning.

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Good morning. It’s great to be with you.

LEVINGSTON: Enforcement powers - what does that mean?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Well, it means that quite often now even when we make good environmental decisions those decisions aren’t properly enforced. For example, in the past, a developer might have been told that they need to protect a block of land that’s got special habitat on it, but nobody really checks to make sure they have. So, we need better, stronger laws. We need a tough cop on the beat that will enforce those laws. When we make decisions, we need to make sure that they’re nature positive. That we leave nature better off overall. And we need to make those decisions faster and clearer because all the delays add to costs and that means jobs.

LEVINGSTON: When you say a tough cop on the beat, that being the Environment Protection Agency, who or what kind of a person is going to head that up?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: The person who heads that up will be a statutory appointment. That means they’re appointed by the Government obviously, but they have a degree of independence because it’s hard to get rid of a person in that position. We’re choosing that statutory role so that it can be a person who can make decisions that the Government doesn’t necessarily like on the day, that they can have the independence to do the job that they’ve been asked to do, which is to turn around environmental destruction in Australia, to make faster clearer decisions, yes, but also to stop the destruction of nature that we’ve observed in Australia in recent decades and to turn it around.

LEVINGSTON: How quickly, Minister, do you think the Environment Protection Agency will be up and running?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: We’ll take this proposal to the Budget next year. We’ll receive funding through the Budget. We’re really looking at next year, not the first half of next year but later. We need to make sure we’ve got our laws right first. There’s no point in engaging someone until some of the law reform process is done. So, there’s a few things we’re doing. We’re changing our environmental laws to make them stronger. We’re setting national environmental standards. So, project proponents will need to know up front these are the rules we’re going to apply. This is the standard you need to meet. That saves time and money for them, but it also means that they’re meeting that higher standard in their application. We’ll do regional planning. I announced yesterday a memorandum of understanding with Queensland. To begin that process in Queensland we will focus on three zones: a renewable energy zone, a critical energy zone and an urban development zone. That regional planning process will take a while. We need to engage with States and Territories and with Local Government.

So, the Environment Protection Agency is one of the group of things we need to do to fix the situation in Australia. And what we’ve seen with the Environment Protection and Biodiversity Conservation Act, it’s more than 20 years old now. We’ve seen no substantial reforms to it in that time and the result is our environment has just been slowly degrading that whole time. The laws as they exist at the moment preside over the degradation of nature in Australia and they’re unfit for business as well. They’re not meeting anybody’s needs. We need to turn that around and make sure we’ve got a win–win, a win for nature, stronger protections, and a win for business, faster decisions and that means more jobs.

LEVINGSTON: You’re listening to Tanya Plibersek, the Minister for Environment and Water. There’s a couple of decisions, particularly in Queensland, where, I think, people will be interested to see how the legislation you’re proposing, the agency you’re proposing will play out. For example, in something like the Waratah Coal project, which was rejected by the Queensland Land Court a couple of weeks ago on the grounds that it would contribute to climate change it’s unclear whether the Palaszczuk Government will approve it, but could the EPA intervene on something like that?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Look, I have to be very careful around specific projects because one of the problems with our system as it exists at the moment is the Environment Minister is the ultimate decision maker and if there’s any chance that I will have a role in making the decision, I can’t prejudge – I can’t express an opinion. So, I have to be very careful. I know that’s frustrating for journalists when they ask questions like this –

LEVINGSTON: I guess, Minister, I’m not asking will or won’t it happen. Or can you think of another working example where another court or a strong case is made about a project’s impact on the environment? If it’s approved by the State Government, would the EPA have a look at it?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Well, if it’s a big project that has an impact on matters of national environmental significance, then the Commonwealth Government and the EPA will have a role in that. So, if it’s threatened species, Ramsar wetlands, migratory species, cultural heritage impact, there’s a range of sort of nationally significant issues where the Commonwealth Government has a role in decision making, and that won’t change. What will change are the standards, higher standards that need to be met, much clearer earlier on so that both project proponents know what they’re letting themselves in for and we can be sure that if we’ve got a piece of land that’s particularly valuable or home to threatened species, that those places are protected and we signal that early on as well.

The question sort of goes as well to issues around carbon pollution emissions; one of the other changes we announced yesterday was big projects during their assessment will have to describe their domestic carbon pollution emissions and what they’re going to do to reduce them or to offset them. And that’s a really important change as well. That transparency around the lifetime carbon pollution emissions of projects will give us another really good piece of information.

LEVINGSTON: Does that include emissions overseas for Queensland coal that’s exported?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: No. And that’s quite deliberate. Our international laws work so that Australia is responsible for our carbon pollution here in Australia. But just in the same way as if you buy a German car and you drive it on an Australian road, it’s not Germany that’s responsible for the pollution of your car as you drive your car around in Australia. It’s Australia that has to deal with those emissions and get them down over time.

So, the other thing I think it’s important to say my colleague Chris Bowen is working right now on the safeguards mechanism that will work with the biggest polluters to get them on the track to zero net pollution by 2050. So, it’s not just our environmental laws that reduce carbon pollution. It’s also the safeguards mechanism that will be applied. We’ve also signed the Global Methane Pledge. We’ve reduced ozone-depleting gases. That’s legislation I’m taking through the Parliament this year. There’s a suite of things we’re doing. We’re increasing renewable energy in our transmission lines. We’re looking at 82 per cent renewables by 2030, so we have to upgrade our transmission network in Australia. We’re making it cheaper and easier to buy electric vehicles.

There’s a suite of things we’re doing to get Australia on the right track, which is zero net emissions by 2050, more renewables in our grid, cheaper, cleaner energy for our Australian families and businesses and our environmental laws will support that, but they won’t replace what’s being done on climate change and energy more generally.

LEVINGSTON: You mentioned Ramsar wetlands. When will you make a decision on the Toondah Harbour development?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Well, the public comment period closed this week and so the proponent of the development has to prepare their final environment impact statement, taking into account all of those public comments that have been made. We’ll get information about the final number of public submissions and so on. So, once we’ve got that final environmental impact statement, I’ll carefully consider that EIS and the public comment that came in during this period, and then I’ll make a decision. But, you know, as a decision maker I absolutely can’t prejudge anything here, but I will reassure you that we take our responsibilities to protect internationally important wetlands very seriously.

LEVINGSTON: Tanya Plibersek, Minister for the Environment and Water on ABC Radio Brisbane. My name is Rebecca Levingston. It’s been a huge year for you. A change of Government obviously, presumably you got your Christmas wish or your new year’s resolution came true.

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: It’s been my Christmas wish for nine years!

LEVINGSTON: So, as you look back on this year, around about this time, the person of the year, the word of the year, the most searched topic, all those lists come out. For you, Tanya Plibersek, what’s your word of the year?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: I think my word of the year is “relieved”.

LEVINGSTON: Interesting. Because I asked my listeners the other day for their word of the year and of those who supported Labor, a lot of them were relieved that your team was in Government. Who’s your person of the year?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: My person of the year is Brittany Higgins. She’s been so gutsy.

LEVINGSTON: What’s your most searched topic?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: “Day walks”. I’ve been planning a bit of bushwalking over Christmas. My search topic is day walks.

LEVINGSTON: Day walks. So, that’s a stroll you can take within the reasonably close to home.

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: That’s what I can convince my children to do without – they’re too old to bribe with jelly beans on bushwalks these days, but they’re drawing the line at camping with me and carrying their beds with them.

LEVINGSTON: Your new year’s resolution for 2023?

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Sort out the family photos. I’ve got to digitise some of these things I’ve got sitting in boxes. That’s what I’m going to be doing.

LEVINGSTON: I don’t know how much time you’ll have to do that, but very much appreciate your time this morning. Merry Christmas. I look forward to talking to you next year.

MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Merry Christmas to you Rebecca and to all your listeners as well.

LEVINGSTON: Tanya Plibersek, Minister for Environment and Water. 2023 will be fascinating to see how things unfold with that overhaul of environment laws and the introduction of an environmental protection agency.