THE HON TANYA PLIBERSEK MP
MINISTER FOR THE ENVIRONMENT AND WATER
E&OE TRANSCRIPT
RADIO INTERVIEW
ABC SYDNEY DRIVE WITH DOMINIC KNIGHT
WEDNESDAY, 28 FEBRUARY 2024
SUBJECTS: Mardi Gras; Bigger tax cuts for more Australians; Gender pay gap.
DOMINIC KNIGHT, HOST: It's also been a big week in the electorate of Sydney, with Mardi Gras coming up on Saturday night and the debate about who should March. Tanya Plibersek is Member for Sydney as well as Minister for Environment and Water. Minister, thanks for joining us.
TANYA PLIBERSEK, MINISTER FOR THE ENVIRONMENT AND WATER: Great to be with you, Dom.
KNIGHT: Now, we should acknowledge that amidst all the celebrations of Mardi Gras, many in the community that you represent and more broadly, are grieving following the discovery of the bodies of Luke Davies and Jesse Baird, at least believed to be Luke Davies and Jesse Baird yesterday. What are some of the reactions that you've heard to what's gone on?
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Oh, I think right across my electorate, but I'd say much more broadly than that, people are shocked and mourning at the loss of Jesse Baird and Luke Davies, and all of our thoughts go out to their family and friends in particular. It's a devastating time, and you know, honestly, it's a really horrific crime that's occurred. Yes, very sad.
KNIGHT: It is very sad. And I'm sorry to throw that at you at the beginning, because it's an emotionally challenging thing. I'm sure we've all been following the news as each step of the way, our smartphones pop up with the latest developments. And, yes, knowing some people who knew one or both of them, and I'm sure many people in that situation, they were much loved and much mourned. But the broader question here, I guess, is the impact on the Mardi Gras. Now, we know that the board decided to withdraw the police's invitation to participate. A deal has now been reached, as I mentioned, where some will be marching in plain clothes. Do you think this is a good resolution to Saturday night?
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Oh, look, I'm just glad that there is a resolution to Saturday night. I know that a lot of police have been marching for many years, and that would include gay and lesbian officers on the police force. I mean, I think it's a wonderful thing that police, serving police are able to be out and marching with their colleagues. You think, that wouldn't have happened 30 years ago. And I think we should be celebrating those advances. I know that it's a sensitive time for the gay and lesbian community. I think we have to take that into account. I understand that the 78ers, people who were bashed by police on the first Mardi Gras, would have really complex feelings about the police marching at times. But I think there's absolutely a way to work through this in a sensible way. And I'm very pleased that there's a resolution today.
KNIGHT: And I guess we've seen that relationship evolve over the years, hasn't it? Such a major event.
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Well we want it to evolve. We absolutely want it to evolve. I mean, we want LGBTQIA+ police officers to be able to be out in their work. We want them to be confident to be their full selves at work. We want young Australians who are, say, gay or lesbian, thinking about a career in the police service to say, yes, that's a place for me. I can do a good job there. I can be a proud member of the force. We want better relationships between the LGBTQIA+ community and the police, because we want people to be able to report crimes, violence, harassment, hate crimes on the street. We want them to feel confident, to be able to go to the police. I think a closer relationship is in everybody's interests.
KNIGHT: And I guess during an investigation like this, you see the liaison officers, the GLLOs that we're talking about, being involved in having some of these conversations with the community, that's a different dynamic, I would imagine, having out police officers involved in these conversations with the community.
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Well, I think being able to go to someone who has some idea of your life experience if you've been a victim of crime, is a really beneficial thing.
KNIGHT: Okay, now the Stage 3 tax cuts passed the Senate last night, as I mentioned. What's been the reaction from your electorate to that?
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Look, I was out doing street stalls on Saturday, and I had lots of people telling me that they were very pleased with the plan, I have to say, even very high income earners. So, of course, if you're on a high income, you'll still get a tax cut of more than $4,500 a year, but you won't get the $9,000 you are going to get under Scott Morrison's plan. I had people in that bracket coming to me and saying, we think your plan is fairer because there's people on low incomes who are going to get no tax cut under Scott Morrison's old plan, people in the middle were going to get a smaller tax cut under Scott Morrison's plan. This way, every single one of Australia's 13.6 million taxpayers gets a tax cut, and most people get a much larger tax cut than they were going to get. So, an example would be the police officers we were talking about say they're on $110,000 a year. They'll get a tax cut of close to $2,500. Or a nurse on $76,000 a year will get a tax cut of more than $1,500, almost $1,600. That makes a big difference to people's lives. I mean, it doesn't take all the pressure off cost of living. We're very well aware of that, but it does make a difference.
KNIGHT: And I guess Tom McIlroy in our politics conversation earlier in the show was saying it had been quite an effective wedge of the Opposition who ended up voting for it.
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Yeah, exactly. I mean, we've got an opposition that says it's a terrible idea, but we're going to vote for it and then they say we're going to change it when they get into government, they're already planning on what they're going to change. Well, I think it's important that they come clean with the Australian public about whether they'll wind back some of these changes or if they're just going to add to tax cuts for people on very high incomes. Where does that money come from? Does it come from cutting services as they've done in the past?
KNIGHT: Now, the Dunkley by-election, of course, is coming up on the weekend. The Opposition's been running very hard on the claim that the police, sorry that the Prime Minister has broken his promise with this policy. What would you say to people who wonder whether they can trust Anthony Albanese's commitments going forward?
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Look, I know that the Prime Minister took this decision very, very seriously. It's not one that he made easily. But when people come to the government month after month saying that the cost of living is really taking a toll, people on low and middle incomes saying to us the cost of living increases are really taking a toll, we did a bunch of stuff before we tried this. Cheaper medicines, more bulk billing, free TAFE, electricity bill relief, higher pensions and payments, higher Commonwealth rent assistance. We did a bunch of stuff to try and take some of the pressure off people's cost of living. But this was the one outstanding thing where we were about to, on the 1 July, see massive tax cuts go to people on the highest incomes and nothing to taxpayers on low incomes. That's just not fair. We just couldn't stand by and let that happen. And so after a lot of consideration and a lot of debate in our cabinet and in our caucus, we made the decision to change Scott Morrison's approach. I mean, it is five years since that plan was legislated. Things have changed in five years, and I think most people get that now.
KNIGHT: I guess it'd be fair to say, though, that the government did take a while. You said that it was a careful consideration, but the cost of living crisis we've been talking about for many months now, is that why it took the government so long to make the call? I mean, certainly many commentators said that the Stage 3 tax cuts should have been dumped earlier in the crisis.
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Yeah. And the reason we didn't make that change earlier is because we did take very seriously the commitments that we'd given. It just became very obvious that even with huge investments in things like cheaper childcare, that's actually reduced the cost of childcare by an average of 11 per cent. Or the cheaper medicines programme, where if you're on, say, one medication like osteoporosis medicine, you'll save $180 a year. Even with those things in place, people were still telling us that they were really feeling cost of living pressures, so we had to look at additional measures. And I have to say, when you look at all of the available options, making changes to the tax cuts, which essentially put the same amount of money into the economy, so we're not risking any greater inflationary pressures, same amount of money going out into the community, but spread so that people at the top still get a cut, but people at the bottom now also get a cut. To my mind, it became the next obvious thing to do that would make a difference.
KNIGHT: Tanya Plibersek is here. She's Member for Sydney as well as Federal Minister for the Environment and Water. At 17 minutes past 6, Dom Knight is my name. Now, this week we saw a detailed breakdown on the gender pay gap from the Workplace Gender Equality Agency. For the first time, individual employers have been named and the gap in those workplaces, those large workplaces, has been identified. Why was it important to name specific employers and profile the gap in those workplaces?
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Well, the Workplace Gender Equality Agency has been doing great work saying which industries have gender pay gaps and describing the problem in quite general terms over the years. And we realised that even within industries, there are quite large gaps between employers. So, you might have seen something in the Herald today that looks at all the people in the fashion industry and some companies have gender pay gaps of over 50 per cent and there's a vast difference. There's some that actually have a gender pay gap in favour of women. Not many, but a few. Actually, getting to that level of detail really gives people an idea of how they're doing as a company and is, I think, a strong encouragement to do better. And what we've seen with the changes, the other changes we've made, like banning pay secrecy clauses and making gender equality one of the objects of the act. These things together mean that we've got the smallest gender pay gap in Australian history now at 12 per cent, and we hope to see further improvements. This is just a simple, it really is a simple thing. When you shine light on inequality and unfairness, there is a strong motivation to improve that inequality and unfairness. And that's why we're going for these large companies, asking them to do the work and describe their gender pay gap and explain it to their customers and their staff.
KNIGHT: Finally, a lot of the gap, from what I understand, does reflect the fact that women still overwhelmingly shoulder the burden of childcare. Will often take a few years off after a child is born, and so on, might return part-time. That happens far more often for women than for men. Can the government do more to help with those sorts of pressures?
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Well, we're doing quite a few things to help. The first is obviously making childcare cheaper, and we've seen the success of that measure, with average prices dropped by 11 per cent. We've also expanded paid parental leave and we are wherever we can, encouraging fathers to take up some paid parental leave as well. It's good for so many reasons, and I'd love to talk more about them, but the division bells are going. I'd love to talk to you about this another time, though, so thank you very much for having me on the show.
KNIGHT: Thanks for your time. All the best with the vote.
MINISTER PLIBERSEK: Talk soon. Bye.
KNIGHT: Tanya Plibersek there, Federal Minister for the Environment and Water and Member for Sydney.
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